Is running a habit for you? If yes, do you believe your running is a conscious choice? If no, how long would it take you to form a running habit? (Hint: A lot longer than you probably think.) What are habits anyway, and how can they benefit you as a runner?
Psychologist Wendy Wood literally wrote the book on habits, appropriately called Good Habits, Bad Habits, and she shares with Coach Claire some of the knowledge she’s gained during her 30-plus years of researching habit-related behavior. She discusses how habits form and how they overcome your intentions, how you can create friction to make your bad habits less attractive, and how good habits can pave the way to expanding your goals and increasing your creativity.
Wendy is Provost Professor of Psychology and Business at the University of Southern California, where she also served as Vice Dean of Social Sciences. A 2008 Radcliffe Institute Fellow, and 2018 Distinguished Chair of Behavioral Science at the Sorbonne/INSEAD in Paris, Wendy has advised the World Bank, the Centers for Disease Control, and industries such as Procter & Gamble and Lever Bros.
Wendy completed her graduate degree in psychology at the University of Massachusetts. She went on to be the James B. Duke Professor of Psychology and Neuroscience at Duke University. Having published over 100 scientific articles, she received numerous awards for her research and teaching. For the past 30 years, her research has been continuously funded by the National Science Foundation, the National Institute of Health, and the Templeton Foundation.
3:55 You are a research psychologist who has devoted the last 30 years to understanding how habits work and you are also a runner, so when I heard about your work and read your book Good Habits Bad Habits, I knew I wanted to have you on the show. First off, what got you started in studying our habits?
5:54 In your book you said, "Intentions are no match for our habits." Can you describe this and basically define what a habit is?
8:16 A running habit, for example, I can use my own experience. I can tell you the first year that I was a runner, I hated every second of it, and then eventually it became just a part of my identity, who I am. It’s obviously my job now, but it took forever for it to be something that I really identified with. Is that really a common experience for most people that you’ve found?
10:10 Does it take a lot less time to establish a running habit for example if you reduce decisions, like run at the same time every day, always have the same pair of shoes, always run the same routes? Is there a shortcut to getting a good habit?
12:46 We crave things that are new. We want to do new and exciting things. But you’re also saying that the repetition, the doing the thing over and over and over again is also what we crave?
16:48 I would love to talk about goals and how they relate to habit. You’ve said that when you’re forming a habit at the beginning a goal is absolutely critical, but as the habit becomes more established, you might not need the goal quite as much or perhaps not at all. And how that relates to running, especially this year so many of our running races, our big goals, have been canceled, and some of the runners react in one way and they completely stop training or almost stop training, and other runners just seem to find brand new goals, other ways to motivate. I would love to hear your thoughts on that and how these two groups are different.
21:30 One thing that I would love to get your thoughts on are how do you establish a habit that isn’t daily, like for example, strength training? I often tell my athletes that they should strength train, lift some weights twice a week or three times a week, and for some people that’s a lot harder than doing it every single day. How do we get ourselves to do more intermittent things on a regular basis, just not on a daily basis?
25:07 You’ve said that bad habits are not that different from good habits as far as the way the brain works. One study that you referenced in your book was the famous marshmallow study, which everybody has heard about where little kids are given a marshmallow, and if they don’t eat it within a certain period of time, they’ll get a second marshmallow. And of course all hilarity ensues and these poor little kids end up eating the marshmallow in most of the occasions, except for some very resilient little kids who end up getting both. What I wanted to ask about, you talk about hiding the marshmallow, hiding the temptation, getting it out of sight, out of mind. Can you talk a little bit about how we can change our bad habits?
31:28 Now that you’re a researcher and you’ve studied all of this about habits, does that mean you do everything perfectly in your life now that you know all this information?
34:01 Another great thing that I learned from your books is If you "remove the friction,” that is what can help you develop much better habits. Can you talk a little bit about the friction?
37:44 Another lesson from your book is that we need to take our thinking brains out of the picture. Is that what you’re saying?
39:19 Wendy, what’s next for you? What questions are you researching now?
Questions I ask everyone:
41:13 If you could go back and talk to yourself when you first started running, what advice would you give yourself?
41:42 What is the greatest gift that running has given you?
42:46 Where can listeners connect with you?
“I had two sons and like many women experienced a weight gain and I was very uncomfortable after they were born. I didn’t like being that heavy. And so I would try all kinds of different things to get myself out running, and it took about a year of trying different things to figure out exactly what was the right approach for me.”
“Once you become a habitual runner, it’s as if you can use that pattern in the service of a whole bunch of different goals.”
“We all have self control. It’s just self control is much more in our environment. It’s much more around us than in us.”
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