Dan King is blistering fast at 61 years old. We’re talking world record breaking fast. He just broke the masters record in the mile for the 60-64 age group, running 4:49:08 to beat the 4:51:85 record set in 2012. But this amazing feat won’t count. Why? Listen in to find out.
Dan also talks about his surprisingly low-mileage training routine, how he incorporates a lot of cross training into his daily life, and his plant-based diet which he believes is key to his performance.
Despite being super fit, Dan has suffered a number of injuries, including plantar fasciitis that has plagued him for years. He talks about a procedure he had to alleviate his heel pain, and how he’s adapted his training and overall lifestyle to stay both fit and injury free.
Dan hails from Boulder, Colorado. At the University of Colorado-Boulder, he ran an impressive 5,000-meter PR of 14:34, but didn’t complete too much after graduation. After building a successful start-up company, he sold his business and retired in 2017.
As of this recording, Dan was preparing to run another mile race that would officially count as a world record if he repeated his August performance. Coach Claire will share Dan’s results at the end of the episode.
Dan is definitely proof that you can train well and be fast at any age, and that there isn’t a one-size-fits-all training plan that all runners must follow. Whether you’re a masters athlete or just aspiring to keep on running as you age, this one’s for you!
Photo credit: Todd Straka
Questions Dan is asked:
5:18 This past August, you ran 4:49:08 in the mile, which is faster than anyone in the world in the 60-64 year old age group. Now, I understand that this may not count as an official world record on a technicality. Can you explain this?
7:16 There’s another race in South Carolina on October 17th that will be USATF certified, and that should count for the world record. And by the time this airs, you will have already raced it, but hopefully you’ll get your official time at that one, right?
8:04 Can you tell us about the race and your strategy?
9:59 You've been a runner a long time. You ran for the University of Colorado in college. But you were not a miler back then, right? What made you decide to specialize in the mile now?
12:43 I would love to talk about your training. Your training is a little unusual for somebody at your level I would think. Can you talk about what a normal week looks like for you?
14:49 You’re missing a big element that most runners think is incredibly important, and that’s the long run. So no long run for you?
15:55 You’re not running a ton of miles or pounding a lot by running over and over again, but you’re spending hours and hours on your off days of running doing something aerobic. So you’re still building that aerobic engine, just not running all the time.
17:18 You have no rest days?
17:27 About 25 miles a week is all you put in for running?
17:52 I would like to go a little bit deeper into your injuries, and especially the plantar fasciitis. You had what’s called a Tenex procedure for that. Can you talk about that?
19:42 What was the recovery from the Tenex procedure like?
20:29 What is the eccentric calf-raise exercise?
21:13 Let's talk about diet and nutrition. Like me, you are 100% plant based. Can you tell us how you decided to become plant based, and what the benefits have been for you?
23:30 You’re plant based, which is not always the same thing as being a vegan. Is that correct?
24:30 What do you eat and where do you get your protein?
26:29 What are your favorite things to eat before a workout or after a workout?
28:19 I’d love to know what lessons have you learned being a Masters athlete that maybe you didn’t have to think about so much when you were younger?
30:17 What do you do for mobility and strength and stretching? How do you fit that into your routine?
31:12 After the race on October 17th, what’s next for you?
Questions I ask everyone:
32:54 If you could go back and talk to yourself when you started running, what advice would you give?
34:23 What is the greatest gift running has given you?
35:20 Where can listeners connect with you?
“I was still under a five-minute mile equivalent, and that was when I was 56. And so it just sort of put a goal in the back of my head that when I turn 60, I want to see if I can still run a five-minute mile.”
“When I turned 40, I just redefined myself as an endurance athlete, not as a runner, and I haven’t not been fit since I’ve been 40.”
“I have gotten really consistent this year in terms of doing electrolytes post-workout. I feel like a lot of the injuries I get as a Masters athlete are because I get more easily dehydrated than I used to.”
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News Article - Dan King's Second Try at Official M60 Mile
“... was more than 4 seconds off his August mark of 4:49 at a meet in the same city. It barely missed the listed M60 American record of 4:53.01 by Nolan Shaheed in 2012.”
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The obesity-related death of his mother was a wakeup call to young, overweight Jeffrey James Binney. He could continue down the same path, or he could change his fate. And so he started running. And running. And running. All the way to the grueling Leadville 100 ultramarathon.
Jeffrey’s film Once is Enough chronicles his journey from couch potato to ultramarathoner. Fueled by grief and the desire to write jokes, his film is part documentary, part standup, and definitely unique!
Jeffrey and Coach Claire tackle such interesting subjects as why on earth he set his non-athletic sights on doing a 100-mile ultramarathon, how he trained, his plant-based lifestyle, and the scourge of blisters and chafing. If you like your motivation served with a side of laughs, this episode’s for you!
Jeffrey is a Salt Lake City based actor, singer, comedian, and "athlete." He grew up on a farm in Laredo, MO before moving to Brooklyn, NY and later Los Angeles after receiving his B.F.A. in Musical Theatre Performance from Missouri State University. Jeffrey has been seen on Late Night With David Letterman, in the 1st National Tour and Chicago Company of the Broadway musical The 25th Annual Putnam County Spelling Bee, and at comedy clubs and festivals across the country.
Questions Jeffrey is asked:
5:22 The reason I wanted to have you on the show is because I saw your film Once Is Enough on Amazon Prime this summer with my family. I subject my kids to a lot of documentaries and this is one that they actually liked! Can you tell us a little bit about the movie and why you wanted to make it?
6:42 While sitting in the hospital waiting room, you happened to pick up a copy of Trail Runner Magazine. What happened next?
7:54 Most people don’t go running a 100-miler basically off the couch, let alone the Leadville 100. What were you thinking?!?! :)
9:51 What was it like running the race under-trained and overweight? That must have been a huge challenge physically for you.
11:20 Don’t you have to qualify for Leadville? How did you get into Leadville?
12:26 What was your typical training week like or how did it progress over your 14 months of training?
13:51 How did you change physically through training?
15:23 Speaking of nutrition, you and I have a couple of things in common besides our gorgeous red hair. You and I are both plant-based! How did that fit into your training, your nutrition? What kind of things were you eating?
18:26 Most people think, “Oh, you’re on a plant-based diet. That means that you’re only eating twigs and potatoes and you’re going to be super thin, and clearly that’s not always the case for everybody, right?
19:17 Without giving away too much from the film, what kind of lessons did you learn? Just going through it and the whole filming and making a beautiful movie? What kind of lessons?
20:26 Do you think anybody can do this?
21:03 I would like to talk about the ultra running community. It’s kind of a special group of some very strange and wonderful people. Would you agree?
23:20 The aid stations are much better for ultrarunning, right?
23:40 I would love to talk about gear, like what kind of gear that you were using.
24:19 Do you still wear a bro?
24:49 Every ultrarunner, every runner, has to deal with chafing obviously. How do you deal with that?
26:58 There’s a point in the movie where you talk about your blisters that you had, and how did you deal with that? You look like you were in some serious pain there.
28:10 You manage your blisters better nowadays when you get them?
29:10 What kind of misconceptions have you come across in your running journey? When you started this, you had so much optimism about what this was going to turn out to be. What changed throughout your journey? What things were you surprised about?
31:21 What’s next for you? Are you still running? Obviously, COVID, there’s not a lot of races on the horizon, but what are you doing?
32:36 Some of the smaller trail races are still going on in person, so maybe there’s something you can sign up for that you could actually do in real life.
33:07 You’re still being coached by Ian Sharman, or are you on your own?
34:09 Questions I ask everyone:
36:08 Any new films on the horizon or was once enough?
“I just went on a hike a few years ago with some friends to one of the taller peaks here in Utah. I was getting to the top and I was really beating myself up because I just could not keep up with them. And I finally got to the top and I was like, ‘Why are you beating yourself up? You have 100 lbs on all of these people. You don’t come from a lifetime of fitness other than five years.’ And you’d think after this whole journey that I’ve been on that I would be able to keep that in better perspective, but there’s still time like that when I still have to check myself.”
“I never considered myself particularly outdoorsy. I certainly didn’t consider myself tough. And it turns out I was wrong. It turns out I am way, way stronger and tougher than I realized.”
“Most of the time I was running 20-plus hours per week on top of a full-time job. It’s literally a part-time job.”
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We really hope you’ve enjoyed this episode of Run to the Top.
The best way you can show your support of the show is to share this podcast with your family and friends and share it on your Facebook, Twitter, or any other social media channel you use.
The more people who know about the podcast and download the episodes, the more I can reach out to and get top running influencers, to bring them on and share their advice, which hopefully makes the show even more enjoyable for you!
Matt shares his knowledge with Coach Claire, dispelling a lot of common misconceptions about the benefits of massage for runners, but also talking about the benefits of massage for anyone, and he does so with a fair amount of humor!
You may recognize Matt as a long-time RTTT and Extra Kick expert contributor. He started his career as a strength and conditioning coach with the National Academy of Sports Medicine. In 2004, he focused on sports therapy, working with distance runners and endurance athletes.
Matt is currently part of a multidisciplinary team of physiotherapists, sports therapists, osteopaths, podiatrists and massage therapists, as well as a lecturer in Anatomy & Physiology. He writes for numerous websites and national magazines, including Runners Connect and Outdoor Fitness.
Along with his running podcast and website called Run Chat Live, Matt holds an annual RCL International Running Conference. The first one was held in Brighton, Sussex with ten world class speakers traveling from Australia, Canada, and the United States. This year, the event has gone virtual, and will be held on October 29th and 30th. Listen to the show for the 20% off promo code.
6:17 You are a running injury and performance specialist and massage therapist. We could talk about any number of running topics, but today I'd like to focus on massage for runners. Let's talk first about some of the myths about massages. What are they and how did they get started?
11:49 What about the toxins? People talk all the time about, “Oh, I’m flushing the toxins. My muscles are building up all of these toxins from the environment or from my run.” What does massage do for that?
13:18 Let’s talk about something that actually does build up in the muscles when we run hard, and sometimes we’re doing this on purpose, is to build up lactic acid. A lot of people think, “I’m going to go get a massage just to get rid of all that lactic acid.” Do you want to talk about that one?”
15:49 If lactate is a good thing, why does it hurt so bad?
16:05 What about improving circulation? I’ve heard that massage can help your circulation. Is that true?
18:03 When I have gotten a massage, they always tell me to drink a lot of water afterwards, and I assume that’s to flush out the toxins or whatever. Can you explain that? Why do they tell me to do that?
19:51 Okay, so we know what massage doesn't do, what does it do?
23:20 So, massage is good because it feels good?
24:26 I don’t know how the idea of massage being good because it feels good is going to be received by people who get massages all the time because they swear by it, like, “Oh, I had a knot in my neck and she just worked at it and I feel better,” or “Oh, I always get these cramps in my hamstring and after I get a massage, they’re totally fine.” There’s got to be something else going on here other than just relaxation.
28:12 What is it with muscle knots? Do muscles really physically knot? I would love to know what’s going on. You can sometimes feel like in your back a hard lump, and if you massage it, it can kind of smooth out. So what’s going on under the skin?
29:52 We often see those free massages at the end of a marathon. Should we be waiting in line for those or should we be skipping those?
31:26 Will massage make you less sore?
32:04 What about massage during taper week before your big race or a week after your big race? What do you think?
35:18 If the main reason for a massage is relaxation, we can always choose other techniques such as getting into a hot tub or doing meditation or yoga. Is there something very specific about massage that is different from other relaxation techniques?
37:20 A lot of us are missing out on the power of touch with the COVID. Are there any ways to get a massage safely these days or replicate the massage experience at home?
39:00 On a more personal note, you are organizing an online running conference at the end of October. Can you share the details about that?
Questions I ask everyone:
42:32 If you could go back and talk to yourself when you started running, what advice would you give?
44:35 What is the greatest gift running has given you?
45:48 Where can listeners connect with you?
“If you are with a therapist who is telling you they’re breaking down scar tissue or they’re re-molding your fascia or something or changing the length of your muscles, then you have to question yourself whether they’re staying up to date with the latest evidence, and a lot of therapists aren’t.”
“Thanks to modern pain science and research which is developing, we know that you can’t fight pain with pain.”
“When we look and consider how important stress is in regards to delaying recovery, reducing the power of the immune system, on so many levels massage can help, not just runners, but any sports person, anybody, to function properly.”
“One of the interesting things which we forget is there’s plenty of people who have got pain when you push down on soft, unknotted tissue. There’s not a clear parallel either in clinical practice or in studies showing a correlation between tightness or lumps and pain.”
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We really hope you’ve enjoyed this episode of Run to the Top.
The best way you can show your support of the show is to share this podcast with your family and friends and share it on your Facebook, Twitter, or any other social media channel you use.
The more people who know about the podcast and download the episodes, the more I can reach out to and get top running influencers, to bring them on and share their advice, which hopefully makes the show even more enjoyable for you!
Were you one of the 30,000 people hoping to run the Boston Marathon this year? Are you hoping to run Boston next year? If yes, then you’ll want to listen to this episode with race director Dave McGillivray.
This year marked the first time since the first Boston Marathon in 1897 that the race was held virtually and not in person. Ordinarily, registration for Boston would have happened in September, but as of right now, October 2020, registration has been indefinitely postponed.
In this week’s interview, Coach Claire talks to Dave about how the virtual event went, how the Boston Athletic Association (BAA) has adapted due to the coronavirus, and what the future of the race might look like, including qualifications.
Dave also shares what he believes to be the silver lining of the pandemic, as well as his own personal health scare story which he started sharing once he learned his experience could help others.
Dave has been the director of the Boston Marathon since 1988, but he also practically invented the concept of running for charity when he ran across the United States to raise money for the Jimmy Fund in 1978. He ran 3,452 miles from Medford, Oregon to Medford, Massachusetts over 80 days, averaging 45 miles per day. He ended his run in Fenway Park to a 32,000-person standing ovation. He has personally raised hundreds of thousands of dollars and has been a source of inspiration to countless others.
Dave has many other incredible athletic accomplishments under his belt as well. 1980 was a big year as he became the 30th person to complete a Hawaii Ironman Triathlon by finishing in 14th place. In subsequent years, he completed the event an additional eight times. That year, Dave also ran 1,250 miles of the East Coast, starting in Winter Haven, Florida and ending in Boston. He was joined by wheelchair marathon pioneer Bob Hall to raise money for the Jimmy Fund, and they met with President Carter at the White House during the Washington, D.C. leg.
And that wasn’t all for 1980. Dave also raised more than $10,000 for the handicapped in the Run For Our Dreams Marathon, running 120 miles in 24 hours through 31 communities in Southeastern Massachusetts, finishing in Foxboro Stadium (now Gillette Stadium) during a New England Patriots game halftime.
In 1981, Dave raised $55,000 for the Jimmy Fund competing in an ultra triathlon which involved 1,522 combined miles of running, cycling, and swimming in six New England states. The race included running up and down Mt. Washington and swimming over seven miles from Martha’s Vineyard to Falmouth, Massachusetts where he was greeted by thousands on the beach.
As though running Boston wasn’t challenging enough, in 1982, Dave ran the marathon in 3:14 while blindfolded, accompanied by two guides, raising over $10,000 for the Carroll Center for the Blind in Newton, Massachusetts.
In 1983, he swam for 24 consecutive hours, covering the distance of the Boston Marathon, to raise money for the Jimmy Fund. He also raised money for his alma mater, Merrimack College, by cycling over 1,000 miles through six New England states in 14 days. He raised more money for charity by cycling for 24 consecutive hours in a five-mile loop in Medford, Massachusetts for a total of 385 miles, while simultaneously directing the annual Bay State Triathlon which was taking place on the same course at the same time.
In 2004, Dave ran across the country a second time for TREK USA with nine other marathoners in relay style, raising over $300,000 for five children’s charities. In 2018, he accomplished the World Marathon Challenge, running seven marathons in seven days on seven continents.
To date Dave has run 158 marathons, including 48 consecutive Boston Marathons (32 of which were run at night after the official marathon.) His marathon personal best is 2:29:58. His Ironman personal best is 10:36:42.
Fun note: Dave has run his birthday age each year since the age of 12. In recent years, he has both run and cycled the miles.
In addition to being a super athlete and philanthropist, Dave is also an entrepreneur, motivational speaker, and author. He has been recognized with numerous honors and awards over the years for his achievements, and through his DMSE Sports and DMSE Foundation, he has raised over $50 million for charity.
5:48 The Boston Marathon was held virtually this year, in September. How did it go?
7:49 I know the BAA discouraged people from running on the course this year, but many people unofficially did. What is your reaction to that?
9:12 I would love to rewind a little bit and go back to February and March of this year. What were you and the team at the Boston Athletic Association talking about in the early days of COVID?
11:29 Obviously throughout the summer you had to go virtual. What was that decision like?
13:05 As we record this, it is just before the London marathon, which shifted to an elites-only race. Was having an elites-only race an option for the Boston Marathon?
14:46 I don’t know how they’re keeping the spectators away in London. I just interviewed Jared Ward and he said, “I don’t know. I’m just showing up.” I don’t know how they’re keeping them away. I don’t know if you’ve had talks with them or no?
15:47 Looking forward to 2021, obviously there’s a lot of things up in the air. Usually in September, everyone is signing up for the next year’s Boston, and registration is to be determined. Can you shed any light on that and give us any hints?
19:01 How does next year’s Boston being up in the air affect qualifying? Usually you have an 18-month window of qualifying races, but obviously this year was totally different. Qualifying for the Boston Marathon is the Olympics for some people and it’s everything, and what they train for, and what they dreamed of for years, so how does that look from a qualification point of view?
20:34 And the virtual race, that’s not going to count for a qualification, correct?
20:43 If things do change and things are looking good for 2021, what kind of things have you learned from this year and how will it be different?
23:18 When you talk about potentially having a smaller field size next year, the first thing that obviously comes up means the faster runners would be qualified. Is that how you would shrink the field size, by increasing the times?
24:12 Boston isn’t the only race that you direct. You do direct some smaller races, and a smaller race, you have more flexibility to stagger the starts and things like that. Do you see some of the smaller races, Falmouth for example, coming back sooner than the major marathons?
26:49 On a personal note, every year after the end of the Boston Marathon you have a tradition of running the race yourself. Did you run on Patriots Day?
28:04 One thing that people might not know about you is that two years ago, you had open heart surgery, which is very uncommon considering you’ve been such a prolific runner for all your life. Could you talk a little bit about that?
32:07 What did your doctor say about running? Is running bad for your heart?
33:56 What kind of advice would you give someone who is training for Boston right now or that hopes to train for Boston?
35:06 Any silver linings from all of this craziness in 2020 that you can think of?
36:55 Questions I ask everyone:
“You had to reimagine. You had to start doing things that you don’t necessarily have a skill set in, whether it’s developing an app, or whether it’s developing a virtual expo. How do you do this?”
“We created a COVID committee of experienced scientists, epidemiologists, CDC folks, governmental folks, and put this group together to sort of help us come to some kind of intelligent conclusion as to truly what are we looking at here for next year’s Boston Marathon.”
“I learned a valuable lesson from my open heart surgery. Just because you’re fit doesn’t mean you’re healthy. And shame on me; I always thought it did.”
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BAA - Boston Athletic Association
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We really hope you’ve enjoyed this episode of Run to the Top.
The best way you can show your support of the show is to share this podcast with your family and friends and share it on your Facebook, Twitter, or any other social media channel you use.
The more people who know about the podcast and download the episodes, the more I can reach out to and get top running influencers, to bring them on and share their advice, which hopefully makes the show even more enjoyable for you!